View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | Date Submitted | Last Update | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0005651 | Valley 1 | Suggestion - Balancing Issues | Feb 6, 2012 11:27 am | Feb 27, 2012 5:04 pm | |
| Reporter | Bluddy | Assigned To | Chris_McElligottPark | ||
| Status | closed | Resolution | no change required | ||
| Product Version | 0.570/0.571 | ||||
| Summary | 0005651: Fighting along with your ghosts | ||||
| Description | One of the problems people have mentioned with the auto-fail missions is that you don't gain anything by dying. In an RPG, even if you die, you gain some XP and maybe find some loot, so that it doesn't feel like you're wasting your time. This is actually one of the big complaints about the GTA model -- you can try a mission many times without succeeding, and gain nothing from the time you spent on that mission. In the GTA model, the only thing that ameliorates the situation is that you can just forget about the mission and do something else for a while since there are so many distractions. This is a problem in AVWW that's exacerbated by the fact that every death introduces vengeful ghosts, so the missions get harder and harder. My idea is to try and give some reward for failing missions. I think this is a good thing in a game like AVWW that follows the GTA model. You never want a player to feel like he's truly wasting his time, and it's a good thing to help him out. The idea actually consists of 2 parts, both inspired by 1. the shattered time concept, 2. the reruns of failed attempts you get at the end of Super Meat Boy and 3. the vengeful ghosts in the game. What I was thinking about is that after a player tries a mission X times and fails, creating X vengeful ghosts in the process, he could start creating good ghosts instead. Basically, if the player persisted and fought the ghosts and really wants to win this mission but he can't, help him out. Ghost X+1 will be a good ghost for whatever reason, and will fight by his side. This means that even while the player lost the first couple of times, he was working his way towards creating allies to fight with. The second, related idea, is that some missions can be in time vortexes. Within these missions, you don't die. If you die, you're just sent back to the past, and you fight aide by yourself from the previous time. I'm not entirely sure how it would work, but the idea I have right now is that you get to play along with a replay of the previous you's that failed. The boss and the ghost you will do exactly what they did last time, and you can try help out, but if you do too much -- for example, if you knock the boss away from where he was last time, the previous you's will keep firing at where the boss was in their time, and they'll be ineffective. So you want to use the predictability of the previous fights and just step in enough to defeat the boss. | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
| Internal Weight | For New Player Experience | ||||
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Let me start by saying that I agree with your original premise, that players are just going to get frustrated by failing the same mission over and over without gaining anything. That said, I'm not sure how much I like the idea of being able to grind for ghosts that are helpful. Your second idea might work for some missions, but certainly not all. We definitely need to refine failed missions some, though I'm not yet entirely sure how. |
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I actually am not sure I agree there is a problem here (except for the vengeful ghosts piling up there). If you keep failing a mission, the better solution is to go off and do something else for a while -- this really isn't and RPG, so being able to get something for losing isn't something I agree with. There's just nothing we could give players. But having players run up against an insurmountable obstacle, evaluate it, and then find a different way around that obstacle... that's more the goal I have in mind. To some extent that requires secret missions (coming today I hope), and to some extent even things like enchants or whatever will be helpful. The mechanics of the vengeful ghosts need to be evaluated either way, but I'm not in agreement with the core premise -- for this game. For something like GTA, I actually agree with you because those missions are long, involve cutscenes, and are linear in the sense that you can't progress without beating them. None of which are true here, where you can always just choose something else instead. |
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I think that the flood of new mechanics since this original suggestion satisfies the core concern as much as I care to at this time. |
| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
|---|---|---|---|
| Feb 6, 2012 11:27 am | Bluddy | New Issue | |
| Feb 6, 2012 12:18 pm | tigersfan | Internal Weight | => For New Player Experience |
| Feb 6, 2012 12:18 pm | tigersfan | Note Added: 0018642 | |
| Feb 6, 2012 12:18 pm | tigersfan | Assigned To | => Chris_McElligottPark |
| Feb 6, 2012 12:18 pm | tigersfan | Status | new => assigned |
| Feb 6, 2012 12:26 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Note Added: 0018645 | |
| Feb 27, 2012 5:04 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Note Added: 0019886 | |
| Feb 27, 2012 5:04 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Status | assigned => closed |
| Feb 27, 2012 5:04 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Resolution | open => no change required |
