View Issue Details
| ID | Project | Category | Date Submitted | Last Update | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 0025427 | AI War 2 | Balance Issue | Jul 17, 2021 11:20 am | Aug 18, 2021 2:13 pm | |
| Reporter | Carl Dong | Assigned To | Chris_McElligottPark | ||
| Status | resolved | Resolution | fixed | ||
| Product Version | 3.313 Input, Selection, And Flagships | ||||
| Fixed in Version | Beta 3.601 Tuning Before A Respite | ||||
| Summary | 0025427: [Gameplay/Game Design] Please revert or change the Cloaked Units No Longer Display On Sidebar | ||||
| Description | I don't design games, but hopefully what I say will make sense, at least for my play style. ## The Biggest Issue: Stealth GP One of the things I already find most tedious in the previous games, is to find out Stealth Guard Posts. Not eliminating all of them causes surprise counter waves, give trouble killing eyes, and unexpected amount of reinforcements. Before the Grav Well update, this was fairly manageable because the Combat Sentry Frigates would cover a good portion of gravity well, and scanning it would not take too long. Unfortunately, this is much more tedious after the Grav Well update, becaues it is common to encounter 70k or even 104k gravity wells. In these case, I must pause, shift-click to order sentry frigates to scan a huge area, without knowing whether the range really cover the entire well. In addition, higher mark GP can survive one or even two scans! The above situation already makes, in exaggeration, "Revealer Battlestation the only choice", if I don't want to spend twenty minutes hunting for remaining GP, in 3.312. In the 3.313 change, this process is even more tedious. Not only I have to do the same exact thing, but I also don't know whether there are Stealth GP at all! At least, not in Planet View. I have discussed on Discord about this issue, and I understand that the number of Stealth GP can be calculated by looking at the number of reinforcement points in Galaxy View and subtracting every other structure from planet view. I tried it -- it is extremely annoying. I must switch between two views, remember which structures are "Major", subtract every type, and see if there are any. This process can easily take 10-30 seconds away from game play, calculating something the player should already know by looking at Planet Info. See -- the number of Stealth GP is not really hidden from player: it is just much more inaccessible. I don't' know much about game design, but this is very likely not what you want. ## Second Issue: It Makes Less Sense Lore-wise, I think it makes less sense than showing the types in the planet view, because how do you even know the strength if you don't know the type and count of the cloaked units? In previous versions I always thought cloaking as "you know it's here, but you don't know its location well enough to shoot at". This came from an Arcen forum discussion I participated in, even before AIW2 was released. Take one bibliography: http://www.projectrho.com/public_html/rocket/spacewardetect.php#nostealth. Of course, if this change really is to improve gameplay, then sure. However, I can say that even with unit type/count revealed, cloaked units are already surprising when they reveal at the wrong place. I am skeptical about whether there really need this extra surprise factor. In addition, there is the same problem about inaccessibility: you would have to subtract visible strength from total strength to deduce whether stealth units are present. ## Third Issue: AIWC Did It Decently In AIWC, all cloaked units are shown in the "Cloaked Units" white circle in planet info. This sort of resolves the accessibility issue above by at least saying that there is "something" without the player having to calculate. ## Suggestions About Stealth GPs: 1. Just show them in Planetary Info 2. Change how they work so they are not so tedious to remove 3. If you really think the Stealth change would drastically improve player experience, go all the way and hide them in Galaxy tooltip too About the stealth change itself, I would really like to know what the developers think this change brings to the player. I honestly think it is all punishment and no fun involved. That bit of extra surprise factor is not well integrated with other part of the game. I mean, do you really want a surprise Poltergeist hitting because it only show up in strength numbers? What do you do to the Ghost AI? How much more tedium required to remove an Eye covered by 10 Stealth GP in a 104k grav well? All these punishment for what gains? It's not like there is an equal change to the AI so they react differently to _your_ stealth units either. | ||||
| Tags | No tags attached. | ||||
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Chris, for your consideration. I haven't played enough since this change to have an opinion. |
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Thanks! * Guard posts and fleet leaders of non-friendly factions now show up on your sidebar even if they are cloaked. ** Previously it could get very hard to find cloaked guard posts. |
| Date Modified | Username | Field | Change |
|---|---|---|---|
| Jul 17, 2021 11:20 am | Carl Dong | New Issue | |
| Jul 17, 2021 2:22 pm | BadgerBadger | Assigned To | => Chris_McElligottPark |
| Jul 17, 2021 2:22 pm | BadgerBadger | Status | new => assigned |
| Jul 17, 2021 2:23 pm | BadgerBadger | Note Added: 0062492 | |
| Aug 18, 2021 2:13 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Status | assigned => resolved |
| Aug 18, 2021 2:13 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Resolution | open => fixed |
| Aug 18, 2021 2:13 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Fixed in Version | => Beta 3.601 Tuning Before A Respite |
| Aug 18, 2021 2:13 pm | Chris_McElligottPark | Note Added: 0062753 |
