View Issue Details
|ID||Project||Category||Date Submitted||Last Update|
|0017521||Stars Beyond Reach||[All Projects] Bug - Gameplay||Sep 25, 2015 1:21 pm||Sep 28, 2015 4:49 pm|
|Product Version||0.910 (Now With Fewer Bugs)|
|Fixed in Version||0.911 (Act I Polish)|
|Summary||0017521: Buildings are fully functional when they should not be.|
|Description||Wasn't sure if this would be considered a balancing issue, or an actual bug, because the buildings do register that they aren't fully staffed and have an existing penalty.|
As it currently stands, buildings will provide their full effect if the only problem they are encountering is a lack of staffing. My current build strategy for turn 1 is always the same, build as many small shops as humanly possible. The buildings register that they are not fully staffed in the fact that they won't level up as quickly, however they still provide the full amount of crowns(shops), power(solar/wind), etc.
While leveling buildings is important in the overall scheme you can easily overcome the long term penalties because you can power build everything you want and just spam birthing centers out mid act-1. This also allows you to rapidly build local authorities in territories and claim territory very early.
This strategy might change with the introduction of act 2 and increased needs, but you'd go into act 2 with a ton of crowns so I suspect you'd be able to overcome any issues fairly quickly.
|Tags||No tags attached.|
||That was the exact way I'm playing in my second playthru. I almost grabbed 1/3 of the map this way 7-8 territories? Powerbuilding small shops is king, crowns become meaningless in a few turns.|
||I'm not so sure that's true. I've done something similar, but I noticed my crowns kept going up after I'd stopped building more small shops as my population went up, and not by even 3000 increments. Still, worth checking out at least. I'll check it out real quick in a bit.|
||Ah, no, the oddity with money was coming from some of the buildings leveling up. You're quite right, seems like as long as a building has a single person in it, it will operate at full capacity.|
||That's not really a bug per se, but rather a design decision that has turned out poorly. I'm still mulling the details of this one, but should have a change in tomorrow.|
I can see why you might go with that, to help alleviate the pain of loosing population to diseases or pollution. If buildings only worked part effectively (particularly hazmats/hospitals) then fixing it would be near impossible, and it is already exceptionally difficult.
Maybe limit the effectiveness on crown production only?
Perhaps a population service amount?
A small shop serves 500 people. If you build 2 small shops you can serve 1000 people. If you have 500 people per shop you get max crowns, otherwise you receive proportionally less. The amount would then increase as it levels, possibly being the same as the needs value. This would be very similar to how it was in prior versions except instead of limiting building placement it limits production.
I don't think you can escape this issue so easily there are far too many reasons that I can't go over in this small space...
What about work priorities?
What about powerbuilding spam?
What about military power and population?
What about ideas like worker efficiency or tech bonuses & levels?
Plenty of interesting ideas. For now, first stab:
* There has long been a "chicken and egg" problem with buildings having their stats go down when they are not staffed by enough people.
** You can get into death spirals on services and similar pretty fast.
*** And in addition to that, you can also have a nightmare actually doing capacity planning if certain needs are fluctuating based on staffing.
*** All in all it can wind up feeling very punitive and very numbers-crunchy in a not-good way on the player end.
** THAT said, the way we've had it in v3 so far where staffing only affects the EXP generation and nothing else is definitely not too good either.
*** That takes away a lot of the incentive for building staff in the first place, and removes most of the penalty for wounded citizens, etc. So a significant portion of the game then winds up having no teeth.
** Overall there is a concept of "building effectiveness," and already the case is that only some stats are affected by this. That building effectiveness is affected by things like events (for good or ill), adjacency boosts, and so on.
** Taking that idea and just applying something parallel-but-separate, the effectiveness based on staffing percent (and less for wounded staffers) now applies to the following properties:
*** Offensive attack power (but NOT militia or defender attack power), crown production, market item creation speed, local event frequency, science and linguistic research, international ability speed, resource gathering speed, EXP gains (as before), construction skill, repair points, vaccine research speed.
*** All of those things are things that are important, but none of them play into the self-governing ebb and flow of services and needs and so forth. Instead it's all stuff that is related to options that the player or AI can take, which is really much more as it should be. You want to optimize so that you can do things, but your city itself doesn't death spiral if you don't touch it while it's not optimized (at least not for this reason, heh).
* Trash produced by buildings is now reduced when the building has fewer staff or less efficiency than full.
** This is not the case for other kinds of needs, power consumption, etc, because those things are all in a web of balance rather than something that just counts up over time like trash is.
||We'll see how it plays out with the next patch/act.|
||Yep, for sure.|
|Sep 25, 2015 1:21 pm||Peons||New Issue|
|Sep 26, 2015 12:46 pm||x4000Bughunter||Assigned To||=> x4000Bughunter|
|Sep 26, 2015 12:46 pm||x4000Bughunter||Status||new => assigned|
|Sep 26, 2015 7:19 pm||gnosis||Note Added: 0043053|
|Sep 26, 2015 11:08 pm||Taikei no Yuurei||Note Added: 0043059|
|Sep 26, 2015 11:35 pm||Taikei no Yuurei||Note Added: 0043063|
|Sep 27, 2015 6:10 pm||x4000Bughunter||Note Added: 0043073|
|Sep 27, 2015 9:03 pm||Taikei no Yuurei||Note Added: 0043078|
|Sep 28, 2015 10:50 am||ptarth||Note Added: 0043079|
|Sep 28, 2015 3:08 pm||gnosis||Note Added: 0043094|
|Sep 28, 2015 4:30 pm||x4000Bughunter||Note Added: 0043109|
|Sep 28, 2015 4:30 pm||x4000Bughunter||Status||assigned => resolved|
|Sep 28, 2015 4:30 pm||x4000Bughunter||Fixed in Version||=> 0.911 (Act I Polish)|
|Sep 28, 2015 4:30 pm||x4000Bughunter||Resolution||open => fixed|
|Sep 28, 2015 4:36 pm||gnosis||Note Added: 0043110|
|Sep 28, 2015 4:49 pm||x4000Bughunter||Note Added: 0043111|