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IDProjectCategoryLast Update
0007349Valley 1Suggestion - UI IdeasMay 28, 2012 12:57 am
Reporterkhadgar Assigned To 
Status resolvedResolutionopen 
Product Version1.030 
Summary0007349: Add "Reroll" option on character select screen.
DescriptionLets face it: Sometimes the list of characters presented to the player is just not great. You could end up with all your choices as lower than average health when you wanted high health.

In any case, it would be nice to have a "reroll" button, to just generate a new list of characters to choose from until you found one that has the stat balance you want.

Here's why I think this is a good idea: as of currently, if I don't see the character I want, I immediately abandon the character and try again. It pops up as a death, but I don't think that's really fair to call it a death. Why did he die? Who knows?
TagsNo tags attached.
Internal WeightFeature Suggestion

Relationships

has duplicate 0007656 closed Roll new glyphbarer choices more intelligently. 

Activities

khadgar

Apr 29, 2012 6:33 pm

reporter  

skelebot factory.jpg (251,643 bytes)   
skelebot factory.jpg (251,643 bytes)   

Chris_McElligottPark

Apr 29, 2012 7:06 pm

administrator   ~0023029

A re-roll button sounds like a great idea, but 10 different skelebots should be impossible to ever get. It should always have at least 2 characters from each unlocked time period, bare minimum. Is that not what you are observing?

Skarlath

Apr 30, 2012 6:11 pm

reporter   ~0023102

If you are going to add a re-roll button, can we get a 'save rolls' button that allows us to carry forth one character from previous rolls or something?

Quaix

May 3, 2012 5:23 pm

reporter   ~0023375

I just had to kill my new character three times to get the stats I wanted. I'd like to do this with a button instead.

nflftw

May 4, 2012 12:48 pm

reporter   ~0023429

I feel like the system should be changed so that each character is quite good, because it's trivial to just kill off your character repeatedly to get good stats and just kind of adds an aspect of "Okay, I have to roll these dice that cost nothing to roll until I get what I want, otherwise I'm shortchanging myself."

MouldyK

May 7, 2012 7:44 am

reporter   ~0023680

Last edited: May 9, 2012 2:07 pm

But each character build would be good for someone else.

Like I hunt for someone with starting 125 health, 125 attack and 100 mana and I am sure people would accept others, but I only want that and that alone. :P

Barty

May 9, 2012 7:10 am

reporter   ~0023840

Last edited: May 10, 2012 2:58 am

If people are just going to kill off their NPCs in order to roll better stats for them, then that indicates a problem to me. A re-roll option seems like a much more efficient way to do the rolls instead of cheesing the death system.

I'm sure the way stats are randomized was meant to give us as the player a chance to make a gameplay decision, but since you can just kill the NPCs off to get more rolls, it is a rather pointless choice, unfortunately. I can't blame you for doing it, even if I personally have never bothered.

As such, I support the re-roll option.

OmegaJasam

May 9, 2012 8:59 am

reporter   ~0023849

I'm inclined to just show every possible combination, or to make repeated re-rolls/death un-apealing myself. Would rather one extreme or the other.

infestedandy

May 9, 2012 10:11 am

reporter   ~0023854

Death in general isn't a big deal in this game. It's a minor setback at best. I also agree that killing yourself again and again to receive the desirable stats is undesirable. I think they could do something better with deaths in the future, but until then the button is a great idea.

khadgar

May 9, 2012 1:35 pm

reporter   ~0023871

@x4000: The above screenshot was at least 8/12 total characters were skelebots. I believe that I had all time periods unlocked when this occurred.

If I encounter the issue again, maybe with some way to reproduce it or a world file where it happens, I'll let you know in a report.

BenMiff

May 9, 2012 6:11 pm

reporter   ~0023886

...the rerolling suggests to me more that there's something wrong with the cost of death, if you can keep dying to force optimal characters rather than choosing good-but-not-absolute-best. I wouldn't want a "reroll" button, though; if going for choose-your-own-statline, I'd suggest a point buy system since there's even less tedium involved.

In order to slow down and make it less worthwhile to do this, maybe reduce the number of characters to pick from by 1 each time you pick a new character to a minimum of 3 choices (each from a different Age if possible); the range of choice would then increased by 1 up to your maximum for every mission (secret or otherwise) completed; it'll also be a good representation of the pool of survivors diminishing as glyphbearers die, and increasing as resources and the like mean survivors can have a little easier life under your care.

CodexArcanum

May 10, 2012 12:49 am

reporter   ~0023916

Maybe rerolls could have an escalating Shard cost? Say 100 for the first roll, then double it every further reroll until some amount of time has passed. That allows an escape valve for bad rolls, or a bit of extra choice if you don't like what you see, but not limitless twiddling to get optimal stats.

khadgar

May 10, 2012 3:08 pm

reporter   ~0023980

The problem with having a downside to pressing any "reroll" button is that until the loophole of abandon-rechoose is fixed, you can keep doing that to circumvent any cost applied.

On another note, the issue of where the survivors on that list come from hasn't ever been explained to me. They aren't people currently in my settlement. Do the people on that list come from:
*Rescue missions that the Ilari somehow completes without your help?
*Cloning of current residents?
*Reanimating the dead?
*Thin air?
*Secret underground cyro-storage building?
*Two survivors have a child?
*Consciousness shards?
*????

So I've accepted that this is a irreconcilable concession for the purpose of gameplay (this isn't a survival game, so), and with that established, it is understood that the characters to choose from on the list come from thin air. Since they aren't tied to any characters I have in the settlement currently, or anything else at all, might as well let me pick the exact character & stat distributions that I want.

Zem

May 10, 2012 4:20 pm

reporter   ~0023982

I would also prefer a "roll your own" option. I recorded roughly 15 continent events when I first joined a MP, and was looking for a specific character: Must be Ice Age, health is fine, attack can be below average, must have 300 base mana. This was a few versions (and days/weeks) ago though, with only 3 time periods unlocked. Now, I prefer 200+ base mana at least.

Side-note: Do the character base stats still use the pre-revised (16/32 stone) upgrade system?

PS. This is what you trade when looking at character stats: 1 unit = Health 16 = Attack 10% = Max Mana 50

Skarlath

May 10, 2012 5:20 pm

reporter   ~0023990

If death is going to have a bigger cost, then you have to ensure that every character that pops up is at least pretty solid... too many with <100 health, <100 attack and <150 mana on some of my 'attempts', especially if i'm playing on the harder difficulties...

if death starts gaining catastrophic consequences, then in multiplayer you could be stuck with a suboptimal character to be fully involved with the rest of the players on your team.

khadgar

May 10, 2012 6:36 pm

reporter   ~0023993

Last edited: May 10, 2012 6:39 pm

@Zem: Don't forget that heat and cold resistance take up potential stat points! Not sure how many.

@Skarlath: This is true. I'm pretty sure that there is a reason they haven't made a bigger death penalty beyond wanting people to avoid reloading old saves to avoid death. In singleplayer, that is a concern, but in multiplayer, you don't necessarily want a bad player to mess up your whole world by dying a lot. It's a fine line.

Issue History

Date Modified Username Field Change
Apr 29, 2012 6:20 pm khadgar New Issue
Apr 29, 2012 6:33 pm khadgar File Added: skelebot factory.jpg
Apr 29, 2012 7:06 pm Chris_McElligottPark Note Added: 0023029
Apr 30, 2012 12:35 pm tigersfan Internal Weight => Feature Suggestion
Apr 30, 2012 12:35 pm tigersfan Status new => considering
Apr 30, 2012 6:11 pm Skarlath Note Added: 0023102
May 3, 2012 5:23 pm Quaix Note Added: 0023375
May 4, 2012 12:48 pm nflftw Note Added: 0023429
May 7, 2012 7:44 am MouldyK Note Added: 0023680
May 9, 2012 7:10 am Barty Note Added: 0023840
May 9, 2012 8:59 am OmegaJasam Note Added: 0023849
May 9, 2012 10:11 am infestedandy Note Added: 0023854
May 9, 2012 1:35 pm khadgar Note Added: 0023871
May 9, 2012 1:59 pm tigersfan Relationship added has duplicate 0007656
May 9, 2012 2:07 pm MouldyK Note Edited: 0023680
May 9, 2012 6:11 pm BenMiff Note Added: 0023886
May 10, 2012 12:49 am CodexArcanum Note Added: 0023916
May 10, 2012 2:58 am Barty Note Edited: 0023840
May 10, 2012 3:08 pm khadgar Note Added: 0023980
May 10, 2012 4:20 pm Zem Note Added: 0023982
May 10, 2012 5:20 pm Skarlath Note Added: 0023990
May 10, 2012 6:36 pm khadgar Note Added: 0023993
May 10, 2012 6:37 pm khadgar Description Updated
May 10, 2012 6:39 pm khadgar Note Edited: 0023993
May 25, 2012 3:54 pm tigersfan Status considering => resolved
May 25, 2012 3:54 pm tigersfan Product Version 1.006 => 1.030